PLEASE explain this logic (or lack thereof) to me

[Wren57]

Here is an exert:

Person1: I was thinking about becoming an outlaw....wad do you think about that?
Person2: haha you should definitely be an outlaw....because the outlaw is unwilling to wait for mankind to improve, the outlaw lives as if the day were here, and i love that most of all.:-P


Now, to me, Person1 is obviously joking. Person2 then takes it and tries to make some profound statement about humanity and society, but fails miserably. They way I see it is that an "outlaw" is the worst part of any society and is what holds it back from "advancing", which is the very thing the "outlaw" won't wait for... therefore the "outlaw" is hindering his/her own desires of mankind's improvement by being a detriment to it... anyone else care to lend a thought or two?

To me it sounded like the 2nd person was also sarcastic...and in the same time, stating what an outlaw really is...sounds like sarcasm to me.

[Wren57]

I know the 2nd person... she wasn't being sarcastic...

Well I don't know then...I'll have to think baout it and get back to you on this one...

Originally posted by highlander

They way I see it is that an "outlaw" is the worst part of any society and is what holds it back from "advancing", which is the very thing the "outlaw" won't wait for... therefore the "outlaw" is hindering his/her own desires of mankind's improvement by being a detriment to it... anyone else care to lend a thought or two?

Do you feel that way about outlaws like Galileo? Copernicus? Tyco Brahe? Magellan?

I could come up with more if you want?

[IALuder]

i was bout to sayt something just like that solpol

[pdiggitydogg]

not all outlaws are bad, say if the "laws" are unjust

[Wren57]

But the definition of an outlaw was different than it is now. Then, there were laws against intellectual progress and new ideas, now there are not. Now, we embrace new ideas and new thoughts as differences of opinion. An outlaw is one who breaks laws (duh), and almost ALMOST all laws in the US are there for the protection of society as a whole...

Originally posted by highlander
But the definition of an outlaw was different than it is now. Then, there were laws against intellectual progress and new ideas, now there are not. Now, we embrace new ideas and new thoughts as differences of opinion. An outlaw is one who breaks laws (duh), and almost ALMOST all laws in the US are there for the protection of society as a whole...

Dear God, please don't get me started. I see the point of view that you are operating from and no offense but it's a somewhat naive/ignorant view of the world.

SO then what do you think?

Well now it depends on the definition.

Anyone consider Howard Stern an outlaw? I've heard the term used for him.

[pdiggitydogg]

I download media off the internet...Im an outlaw
I used to have a black box and got free cable...Im an outlaw
I sometimes curse in public...Im an outlaw
I have stolen things from stores...I am an outlaw (that was a long time ago)
I have consumed alcohol before my 21st birthday...Im an outlaw

(though...when i think of the word, I think of bandits and bank robbers in the wild west)

[Wren57]

No, I don't consider him an outlaw at all, as I don't see that he perpetuates any negativity on society. Some will disagree with me, but I honestly don't believe he is a detriment to anyone. As Kool-Aid asked, please give us your idea(s) instead of merely nay-saying and bashing mine. I'm not being rude, just think it would make for an interesting debate, but do ask the playing field be leveled for such a debate.

I just meant by my comments that nothing will ever change if we just go by "those are the laws" or "that's what's accepted."

Nothing ever changes if everyone just sits around and accepts things. Someone must be considered an "outlaw" to get other people thinking about some things that are outdated or silly or just plain wrong.

Originally posted by highlander
No, I don't consider him an outlaw at all, as I don't see that he perpetuates any negativity on society. Some will disagree with me, but I honestly don't believe he is a detriment to anyone. As Kool-Aid asked, please give us your idea(s) instead of merely nay-saying and bashing mine. I'm not being rude, just think it would make for an interesting debate, but do ask the playing field be leveled for such a debate.

I wasn't trying to be rude either just so you know.

Many people take being called naive/ignorant the wrong way. It's not an insult, it just means you don't know. Yet.

[Wren57]

Hrm, Pdiggs, you bring up an interesting point. Does anyone find that an outlaw is different from someone who breaks the law? I do. I think an outlaw is more of someone who is on a crusade against society and wants to break laws simply to be breaking the law, not for any other reason...An outlaw isn't someone who breaks the law, it is someone who lives outside the law, hence the word. Pdiggs, you live within the law, and just because you may have stepped outside of it a few times does not mean you live outside of it...

[Shaved &/or Laid]

i dont like in-laws


tupac's outlaws are cool

outlaws are cool.

[Wren57]

Originally posted by SolPol
I just meant by my comments that nothing will ever change if we just go by "those are the laws" or "that's what's accepted."

Nothing ever changes if everyone just sits around and accepts things. Someone must be considered an "outlaw" to get other people thinking about some things that are outdated or silly or just plain wrong.

This is simply not the case. The last words from SLC Punk (highly recommend if you haven't seen it) are "But I realized that I could do more damage to the system if I were inside it, than outside it." or something along those lines...

[pdiggitydogg]

I dont know...that, to me, is more of a rebel than an actual outlaw.

[GT40FIED]

As far as the logic is concerned, an outlaw can serve a useful purpose. A guy named Robert Merton divided usefully deviant societal types into 5 categories...I suppose outlaw would fall under "innovator". They seek the same goals as the rest of us but reject the norms and mores that we have and obtain the goals through illegitimate means. Now...as for the statement "Person2" made, it's insanely moronic and a pathetic attempt at existentialism. It's an attempt to fall in love with that sort of carefree-cum-stupid "live for today" ideology. It'd be great if we could all live like there was no tomorrow. The problem is that, with the exception of one day of your life, there WILL be a tomorrow. You'll meet a ton of people like this...especially in college. The psuedo intellectuals who don't have a clue and will prove it by saying stupid shit like the quote you put up.

[Wren57]

Thank you Steve... *bow*

[ChrisCantSkate]

well... we godda define outlaw. is it someone who deliberatly breaks laws? or is it someone who lives their life the way they want without regard to laws. although both can have positive effects on the progress of society looking at them in an optimistic point of view, such as the sons of liberty, or something to that effect, however there are the bad outlaws that i think we can all think of.. bank robbers, thiefs, drug dealers, etc.

simply stating that you want to be an outlaw is way to broad of a idea, and probobly not a very well thought out one, if he has a plan, an reason, and a final goal then i guess it could be a "good" idea as long as it isnt being a drain on society.

Wren, regarding your comment on people welcoming ideas more today than in the past is partly true. Yes we do value science more than humanity did in the past, but please, tell me what would happen if you made a discovery like Gallileo or Copernicus did today, you'd get challenged the same way. Another problem with today is that science is being dictated more in the way where there is more money involved than more revelations. And last but not least, there is still some degree of control from the government about what they want to release to the public as general scientific knowledge and what they keep to themselves in their "secret labs". I'm sure science is more advance in reality today than what we have on the general market and use as knowledge. Now I'm tired as I'm typing this up right now so if something is unclear, ask and I'll try to rephrase it.

[mylittlecivic]

Not all Changes are for our benefit, lots of changes are made to benefit peoples wealth, status, and power, power which most people who have power use in corupt ways. I personally am not too big on changes some are good some are shitty, I accept some and refuse some.

[Wren57]

Oh my... here is another one... this girl is in a serious need of a reality check.


"We are the music makers, and we are the dreamers of the dream. Wandering by lone sea breakers, and sitting by desolate streams. World losers and world forsakers, for whom the pale moon gleams. Yet we are movers and the shakers of the world forever it seems. "

[pdiggitydogg]

that girl needs to get hit in the face with a pie......banana cream I think

[MAXed Out]

Originally posted by pdiggitydogg
that girl needs to get hit in the face with a pie......banana cream I think

It will be a waste.

[pdiggitydogg]

but funny

[GT40FIED]

Well...that sounds more like poetic expression than straight up stupidity but it still has the same underlying tones of "look at how esoteric I am". If you personally know this girl, I suggest you undertake the following steps:

Step 1: Raise your arm (either arm is fine)
Step 2. Open fist so your hand is flat
Step 3: Bring arm across in a backwards motion so the back of your hand makes contact with her cheek
Step 4: Repeat as necissary.

This girl has to be stopped. Her rampant stupidity could infect other because, as we all know, stupidity is a disease and it is extremely contageous.

[mylittlecivic]

hahaha that girl needs to stop smokin dope

[Wren57]

OK, so the real question... who has figured out who "person2" is yet...?

[mylittlecivic]

uh dunno? not your x is it?

[Wren57]

Nope, not my ex... my ex's roomate. It really isn't suprising with people like her around my ex that she has become so f*cked up. You are very right Steve, ignorance is contagious and has proved itself so in this case... oh well, I just find people-watching very interesting and like observing how people age (notice I didn't say "grow").