[silver]

ok, having read through all of this 3 times(thanks to both of you, i now want my 25 minutes of wasted life back). you both have said the exact same things over and over. with the exception of the previous flaw that i posted on, both of you are correct.

tengoku-don't use f1 cars as a comparison, a 10 cylinder 3 liter motor compared to a 4 cyl 1.6 liter motor is a different ballgame with absolute opposite tuning ideas behind them. i understand your analogy but you need to compare apples to apples to make it viable. plus your knowledge of turbos and their affect affects on a honda motor do not seem to be that great, generalizing a 13 sec car by putting on a turbo is not how things work, you should know that.

az-business as usual for you your remark about the b and d16s and their cr was pretty much addressed by him though earlier when he stated the comparisons between equal motors with different b/s ratios. and you're correct about the longer stroke idea, since the cylinder is always further down the cylinder at the same given crank position less cylinder pressure at moderate speeds its volumetric efficiency is excellent, giving killer tq numbers.

i was waiting for someone to hit on the volumetric eff. but it didn't happen. short r/s ratios at high rpms cause the mentioned high piston speeds, causing poor airflow due to the lack of time to fill the cylinder, so that is why a high r/s ratio is wanted.

now i think the question is about tq right? first off i want to know where you're getting your h22's from cuz when we dynoed my friends h powered hatchback, it put down 160whp and 134lbs/tq, it was a 98 motor with 22,000 miles on it, us spec, bone stock. after i dynoed an rsx type-s with around 800miles on it, i got 168whp and 124lbs/tq. doesn't look as impressive with real world numbers does it? this reminds me of the arguments regarding putting a vg30dett into a silvia.

as for saying that tq is a direct proportion to the stroke, it's not, it's just the easier way of building the motor. you spoke of dimensions and yes it's a dimensions game. by adding to the stroke, you are adding merely height to the motor, while by adding bore you must multiply that by the number of cylinders causing the motor to get wide really fast.

it's 5:10am i'm tired. good night guys